26: Embracing Your Sensitivity + Socializing On Your Own Terms
With Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali, LMFT
Have you gotten stuck in the belief that HSPs are fragile? In this episode, I talk with Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali, LMFT about celebrating your sensitivity and:
• Teaching people how to treat you and communicating that your needs are different
• Setting firm, but kind boundaries and how to manage pushback
• Finding fulfilling ways to socialize without the overwhelm or social pressure to show up like everyone else
• Rewriting the messages that say HSPs are weird, too sensitive, shy, or weak
• It’s possible for highly sensitive people to be ambitious, resilient, and strong
Ibinye is a licensed marriage and family therapist for couples and women with anxiety and insomnia. As a coach, she helps highly sensitive women set clear, kind boundaries, so they can put their needs at the forefront of their lives, stand up for themselves and rock social situations. When she's not working with HSPs she loves trying out new foods and taking naps.
Keep in touch with Ibinye:
• Website: http://www.thezinniapractice.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thezinniapractice
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thezinniapractice
Resources Mentioned:
• Individual Coaching for Highly Sensitive Women: https://calendly.com/ibi-k7ob/consult
• HSP Self-Test: https://hsperson.com/test/highly-sensitive-test
Thank you to Cozy Earth for sponsoring this episode.
Cozy Earth offers super soft and sustainably sourced bedding and loungewear. Use discount code SENSITIVE at checkout for up to 40% off. https://cozyearth.com
Thanks for listening!
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This episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Some links are affiliate links. You are under no obligation to purchase any book, product or service. I am not responsible for the quality or satisfaction of any purchase.
Episode Transcript
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 0:00
We tend to run more passive, which is you matter, but I don't matter. No, we both should matter. So, which is why I'm all about kind boundaries, Because everyone matters. I can still be firm with you and say what I need and express my hurts, while being kind to you at the same time.
April Snow: 0:26
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the people who live with hearts and eyes wide open. I'm your host, psychotherapist and author, april Snow. I invite you to join me as I deep dive into rich conversations with fellow highly sensitive people that will inspire you to live a more fulfilling life as an HSP without all the overwhelm. In this episode, I talk with Ebene Ashibodu Anyali about accepting your sensitivity, teaching others what your needs are, setting firm but kind boundaries and finding fulfilling ways to socialize on your own terms.
April Snow: 1:08
Ibinye, or Ibi for short, is a licensed marriage and family therapist for couples and women with anxiety and insomnia. As a coach, she helps highly sensitive women set clear, kind boundaries so they can put their needs at the forefront of their lives, stand up for themselves and rock social situations. When she's not working with HSPs, she loves trying out new foods and taking naps. For more HSP resources and to see behind the scenes video from the podcast, join me on Instagram, tiktok or YouTube at Sensitive Strengths, or sign up for my email list or YouTube at Sensitive Strengths or sign up for my email list. Links are in the show notes and at sensitivestoriescom. And just a reminder that this episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Let's dive in Ibi. Can you start off by telling us your HSP discovery story, how and when you realized that you're a highly sensitive person?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 2:27
Oh my goodness, I literally remember the day Okay. So all of my life I've always felt like I didn't fit in anywhere. I felt like I was weird. Well, I was literally called weird by all the kids in school all the time. So I was just like I'm weird. I was told I was too sensitive, I cried too much, I was a crybaby, a drama queen, all the names. So I was just like, okay, all right. And then one day I was at work. I was an adult. By then I was an adult and I was also a therapist. By this time I had never heard about high sensitivity, even as a therapist. This is after grad school, by the way, even as a therapist this is after grad school, by the way.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 3:07
And I'm at work, just sitting down minding my business, and I get a text from a friend of mine and she says I think this is us and I'm like what, what is she talking about? And it says like highly sensitive person test. And I remember my first instinct was is she insulting me? I thought she was my friend because all my life I've been called too sensitive and I'm like I don't understand what this is coming from. Is this an insult?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 3:33
So I click on the link and it's the highly sensitive person self-test and I'm answering yes and yes and yes, and I'm like, oh my gosh, this explains my entire life. And in that moment, I felt like my world went from black and white to color. I was like, yes, this is us, this is exactly us, yes, so I will never forget that moment. And from then on, research, and I'm reading all the books, I'm on blogs, I'm noticing like some of my loved ones are highly sensitive. We're having conversations, I'm sending the test to them and I'm like, oh, she was not indeed insulting me, because we're both highly sensitive. I get it now.
April Snow: 4:22
Oh, what an amazing moment. And it makes sense that initially you thought this is an insult, because that's what you heard your whole life. Right, sensitive is often a derogatory term, it's used as a negative, but when you step back it's like, oh, she was in this with you, yes, oh, what a beautiful moment once you could step into it and it sounds like you just dove right in. There was no resistance.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 4:45
Oh yeah, oh no, not at all, Not at all. I was like, if there is a thing that can describe how I have felt my entire life, I would love to know more and I think because it wasn't just me she's one of my dearest friends and she's also highly sensitive and we've walked kind of like parallel paths, so it just made sense. I was like let's learn this together. And it was just. It was so amazing.
April Snow: 5:10
Isn't that beautiful that immediately you had a friend appear in that, a fellow HSP because we're often drawn to each other even if we don't really know what the trait is right, so you just sense it in someone. Oh, this is another kind of deep thinker, feeler.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 5:25
Yes, yeah, amazing, and it makes sense why she's one of my dearest friends, because we just connected the moment we met yes, there's something about her.
April Snow: 5:34
You knew this is my person. Yes, that's beautiful. So about how many years has it been now since that happened?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 5:41
if you could guess I would say 10 years, probably about a decade.
April Snow: 5:47
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah and you mentioned something important there, which is even and I had the same experience. Well, I had. I found out in grad school, but not through my curriculum, but through a friend just happened to say have you read this book, dr aaron's highly sensitive person? Yeah, but we don't learn it in school, even as therapists.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 6:05
No, no, not at all, not at all.
April Snow: 6:07
That's how unknown it is, unfortunately.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 6:12
Yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah. And my dear friend was a therapist as well. We went to grad school together. She had never learned about it either.
April Snow: 6:21
Right, right, it's just not in the curriculum. I mean, we're seeing more and more research, but it still hasn't made its way into therapist's office, doctor's offices. Yeah, yeah, hopefully that changes. I hope so. That's why we're having this conversation.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 6:37
To be part of that.
April Snow: 6:38
Yeah, so in that last decade, how have you transformed your relationship and brought your sensitive needs more to the forefront?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 6:46
Yeah, yeah. The first thing that it helped me do to understanding what sensitivity was was number one. It was self-acceptance, because all of my life I have felt like people didn't accept me, but I actually didn't realize that I didn't accept my own self until I started this journey of high sensitivity. So the first step I had to do was you know what Ibi? There's a name for it. Now You're highly sensitive. It's not going away, it's not a bad thing. You are not a mistake. Because I thought maybe I'm a mistake because I don't know, I don't know what's wrong with me, right? So that was my first step is you're OK?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 7:32
And then after that, I spent a lot of alone time and I started spending time in nature. You know, before I found out I was highly sensitive. I don't know why I never spent time in nature. It was just like cocooned in my own room. I don't know why I was doing that, which is like really awful for high sensitivity.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 7:44
So I started hiking, just kind of just spending time in nature and with that, learning to really just listen to my own thoughts and my own needs, and I would just kind of almost talk to myself like, okay, debrief myself, debrief the day. And then that kind of gave me the energy to start to set boundaries with other people, because I realized if you are one of the 30% or 20%, that's highly sensitive. The other 60 to 70% or 80 to whatever the percentage is, they don't get you. And so if you are to live with them, you kind of have to do a little bit of education, right? And so I started with the people around me like I found out this thing and I would send everybody the test and they'd be like, yeah, this is you, this is definitely you. And they were like, oh, and I let them know, stop calling me too sensitive, I'm the right amount of sensitive, okay, yeah, like I just I just went right in.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 8:47
Stop saying that I'm a drama queen. I am not dramatic. These are my emotions. They are big, there are many. They are bountiful. My emotions mean something, so you are going to stop this. And they were like, oh, okay, like, okay, and really I just started to also slow myself down.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 9:10
I'm super high, achieving. I grew up in like one of the most competitive Nigerians. Like, let me just say it, I'm Nigerian and we are just like, look here, from the moment you were born, you will accomplish A, b, c, d, e, f G. Like, from the moment you are born, you will accomplish A, b, c, d, e, f G. Like that's just it, right. And I'm like how do I accomplish things and honor my needs at the same time? And I've learned how to like structure my day, not caring what people think, like that.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 9:38
That part was hard, cause I also I grew up in a collectivist culture where you are the people, you are your family. Whatever I, you are your family. Whatever I do reflects upon my family, and I'm learning to just and I say learning because I haven't arrived. I'm still growing every day, learning to honor my needs for slowness, for stillness, learning to set boundaries, to say this is enough. I'm going home now. I love you, but I'm going home now. Can you turn the TV down a little bit, because it's sounding like screams in my ears. And that's what I've been doing is just because I'm no longer ashamed of who I am, I'm able to like, step forward and just be like this is me, guys, and I'm not changing, and you all are going to have to adapt a little bit, same way I've been adapting in this very big, loud world.
April Snow: 10:29
Exactly, we all need to adapt and do our part. Yes, and what you said is so important. I used to think, oh, this is the downtime, or boundaries, or the foundation. It really is self-acceptance. You can't do anything else unless we believe our trait is real and, like you said, it's not going anywhere. Your emotions are valid and I love the ability to stand up for yourself in that, because it's true, you are you and there's nothing wrong with that. And then we all need to do our part in kind of softening for others making room for others Right.
April Snow: 11:07
Yeah, absolutely. How did people receive the new you who's coming forward with your sensitivity proudly? I'm just curious how people responded to that so.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 11:19
I started with the people that I knew were safe. Yes, I started there with the people that I knew were safe. Yes, I started there. People who I know are natural acceptors, people who I know are listeners, who are more empathetic, understand. I started like with the safest people and gave them some material to read and they were like oh, I get it. Now it makes sense why you've been this way all of your life. And then I let them know, as I'm learning, I'm going to start teaching you. And they were like okay, okay, or like certain things they'd say to me that were funny before, like they thought was funny, and I'm like we don't say that anymore. They're like okay, okay, yeah, that's right, we don't do that anymore. Right, and they were accepting. And it's so funny because over the years they would almost like refer people to me. They're like I think she's highly sensitive, can you tell her more?
April Snow: 12:18
The HSP whisperer yes.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 12:22
I'm the flag bearer for HSPs, I guess, so it was good. And then, for those who weren't so accepting, or for those who were like this is not a thing, I set really hard boundaries. I'm like, well, I can only now take you in doses because I'm telling you that this is a thing, this is what I need, even if you don't agree that this is a thing. I'm just telling you like this is what I need to have a better, more civil relationship with you. And you're rejecting that, and so I'm going to have to protect my peace, like we can only like be together for like a millisecond before like implode, and so I can't do that. I don't want to implode.
April Snow: 13:02
Absolutely Right. Your needs don't change just because they don't agree. Right, exactly. So you talk a lot about setting kind but firm boundaries. Yes, can you say more about that? So someone is ignoring your needs or not recognizing your sensitivity, or even just trying to turn your no into a yes, because that happens a lot. Yes, how can we be firm but kind?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 13:24
when we're setting a limit. Yes, I'm a big, big, big fan of kindness, right.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 13:29
I'm a big, like it doesn't really matter. There's just so much hostility in the world. I'm like let's bring the kindness back, okay. So first of all, just take a breath, because sometimes when someone is trying to overstep a boundary, we can get very frazzled. There's so many emotions it feels like a hurricane, at least for me.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 13:50
Just take a breath, breath, center yourself, ask yourself what is it that I'm experiencing in this moment and why am I experiencing this in this moment?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 14:01
So I'm clarifying what's going on for myself first, before I communicate that with the other person. And then, when you feel like you're able to communicate, let the person know like okay, I would like to address something with you, right, and then you tell them when you said X Y Z, or when this happened, I felt X Y Z, yeah, and here's what I need from you, because sometimes we stop at this is how I feel, this is what you did, but we don't tell them what you're needing, and so they don't always know what you need. And then after that, give yourself a pat on the back, because it's very, very difficult to set a boundary, especially because a lot of us HSPs have been used to just listening to what everybody says, not really honoring our needs so we can easily default to that. So when you start to stand up for yourself, it feels uncomfortable. It actually feels very unkind for some people to set a kind boundary.
April Snow: 15:06
So a kind boundary can also feel unkind.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 15:09
Yes, it can feel unkind because you're essentially telling the person you can't get your way. So that could feel unkind, right, right, even if the person is saying something mean to you because that has been what you've been used to. They say you're too sensitive, you're a drama queen, blah, blah, blah. And then you kind of giggle and you laugh and you just go along with it. So the moment you say you know that actually hurt my feelings and what I need from you is to refrain from that type of language with me. And then you see the look on their face like what Did she just set a boundary?
April Snow: 15:45
That's what feels unkind, Right? It's a shock to them because they're so used to you saying yes all the time, just completely erasing yourself.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 15:49
Yes.
April Snow: 15:49
And your needs. Yeah, yes, absolutely.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 15:52
And the last piece I would say is sometimes when you set a boundary, even when you do it kindly, you might get pushed back.
April Snow: 16:02
It's not a guarantee.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 16:04
It's not a guarantee that they'll be like oh my goodness, I apologize, I know that hurt your feelings. Sometimes they'll say I was just kidding, like you never liked to take jokes, and blah, blah, blah. We still keep our feet firmly planted on the floor and we say that hurt my feelings, I don't condone that language Like that. I don't care what their their response is. That hurt me. We don't condone that language. I don't care what their response is. That hurt me. We don't allow people to continue to hurt us because we think it's unkind to set a boundary.
April Snow: 16:31
Right, you said this message a few different ways. But teaching people how to treat us, yes, and letting people know what's happening inside, because they don't know, they don't know and we get into these patterns. The hsp tend to be the giver, the self-sacrificer, but we don't have. We can turn that around, yes, but it's going to be uncomfortable at first with a lot of people and I appreciate it. You said earlier, you know, start with the safe people yes to get practice?
April Snow: 17:01
Yes, and then we can move on to things that are maybe more escalated. But it just because it feels messy or unkind or you have to push back a little bit, doesn't mean it's wrong. It's such a good reminder Try it again. Yes.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 17:15
Yes, yeah.
April Snow: 17:16
You seem like you've. I'm feeling inspired by just how solid you are in this. I think we really need to hear that you can be sensitive and you can also be firm.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 17:26
Yes, absolutely.
April Snow: 17:27
Yeah.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 17:28
Yeah yeah, sensitivity is not the same as fragility.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 17:32
Yes, Thank you, cause I feel like we, we think we are like eggs, and then, if we set a boundary, we'll get stepped on and then that's it Humpty, dumpty, a million pieces. And then we set a boundary, we'll get stepped on, and then that's it Humpty, dumpty, a million pieces, and then we can't put them together again. It's like no, no, no, like you can still set firm boundaries, you can still help people understand you better, you can have safe relationships and be sensitive. At the same time, you can say to someone this hurts me, please don't do it again. That's very respectful, that's very kind and it's still firm, all at the same time.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 18:07
We could. We could it's, it's not either or it's and yes, it's both end, exactly.
April Snow: 18:12
And hsp, we don't think about this, but somebody's talking about with clients a lot is how resilient we actually are, because just think about how much more you're feeling and sensing and noticing, and yet we're still functioning at the same level as everyone else, even with that what did you call it? A tornado happening. Yes, yes, yes, exactly. So, taking time to really acknowledge that resilience, that strength, and I appreciate earlier you said you know, with your being a Nigerian, you're very ambitious, yes, and that didn't seem. That seemed like a welcomeian. You're very ambitious, yes, and that didn't seem. That seemed like a welcome part of you. It didn't seem like a fight. I don't know if that's true or not.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 18:48
No, that's, that's just, that's just ingrained. Is you will accomplish all these things? You know, the sensitive part is the part that was like is she crying? Are those tears? No, no, no, no. We don't do that. That's uncomfortable. Don't wipe your eyes. We don't do that Right.
April Snow: 19:02
But you can be both, and yes, and that too. You can be strong, you can be ambitious, you can be boundaried oh yeah, absolutely. And sensitive, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I, just to come back you were saying you were kind of laying out this framework, you always coming back to putting your feet on the ground. Yes, that's such a good start in any scenario. Yes, take a moment, take a breath, check in with yourself, remind yourself why you need this boundary.
April Snow: 19:30
Yes absolutely yes, and then repeat as often as possible and if that doesn't work, remove yourself, Limit time, that's it. I think that's another reminder. I think we feel like we have to just bear it with people, and that's not true. No, no, absolutely Absolutely yeah. If we're feeling unkind, how, or how do you personally work with that? Or work with clients when they're feeling that guilt, even though they've been kind, but it doesn't feel that way, or the person doesn't like what they have to say? How can we manage that?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 20:04
Yeah, yeah. A common statement I say to my clients is are you throwing yourself in the fire to keep others warm? And that's a thing I say like that's the benchmark. So run through the statement. You said please. You said say to the need. You didn't attack their character. There was no blaming, it was honest. You set the boundary clearly. You said what you needed. What part of that is actually not feels unkind, but what?
April Snow: 20:33
part of that is unkind.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 20:34
And then they're like actually no, that was actually a very polite way to set a boundary, Okay. So sometimes we have to remove and I know it's difficult because, as highly sensitive people, were big feelers. So sometimes I'm like, let's go back to the thinking brain. It was not indeed unkind, Like the actual words that came out of your mouth were very kind. They were very assertive and reminding yourself that assertiveness means I matter and you matter, Cause we're we tend to run more passive, which is you matter but I don't matter. No, we both should matter. So, which is why I'm all about kind boundaries, because everyone matters. I can still be firm with you and say what I need and express my hurts while being kind to you at the same time. So it's just I say sit in it. Sit in the feeling of oh, my gosh, this is just like. Oh, I'm squirming right now. Sit in it, take a deep breath, remind yourself okay, I've run through the whole thing.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 21:32
That was not indeed unkind. This feeling that I'm feeling on the inside is because it's something new that I'm not used to. With time and with practice, you'll feel settled and it'll go away. So I don't run away. I don't teach people to run away from emotions. I say feel the feeling. Then go up to your rational mind and ask yourself is what I'm feeling actually? What's going on, Right, Right? And then just sit there, breathe, It'll go away, and then we move on. And then the next time they overstep your boundary, you set the boundary again. Sometimes we think that if I set a boundary once, the person's going to get it Even safe. People sometimes default to their old behaviors, right, so we just have to remember when we talked about this, remind them again. They apologize, All right, and then we keep it moving. Boundary setting is a lifelong endeavor. It's not just a one and done.
April Snow: 22:25
That's right, it's ongoing. Yes, I appreciate that reminder just to keep practicing and we don't need to get lost in the feeling of recognize it, acknowledge it, feel it. But then remind yourself, right right, I wasn't unkind here, I was completely reasonable and reconnecting to that the reason why you set the boundary in the first place, and then remembering oh right, this was the right thing to do yes absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm no longer throwing myself in the fire to keep people warm.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 23:01
Like we can all be warm and and we don't all have to be in the fire. Like no one has to be in the fire.
April Snow: 23:06
That's right. No one has to be sacrificed. No, no, we can all find a space around the fire. We don't have to be in it. Exactly Such a good reminder. So we talked about setting boundaries. I want to expand that out to the social experience of HSPs. This I want to expand that out to the social experience of HSPs. This is another area you talk about quite a lot and I love how you talk about it can be enjoyable, because you mentioned earlier, there was a time where you kind of stayed in your little bubble. Yes, yes.
April Snow: 23:32
Just to go back there. I'm curious what changed for you, knowing that you're sensitive? How did that help you shift out of the bubble?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 23:39
Yeah.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 23:40
So when I was a child, I was often told that I was shy, yes, and so I took that on. I'm like I must be shy because when I'm in social spaces I feel like I'm really squirmy, I'm very uncomfortable. You would find me like somewhere in a corner. You wouldn't even notice me, like I was the child who like where is she? Is she here? Oh yeah, there, she is, that little one somewhere there. That was always me, and I remember saying this to my mom. Once I said to her actually I said it to her on multiple occasions I said I would love to just camouflage myself in the wall. She's like what does that mean? But that was how I felt as a child, as a teenager, like I just want to be invisible, because the feelings were too much.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 24:25
So once I found out that I was highly sensitive and I found out that you could actually have an enjoyable social life, I was like I want to practice this because I genuinely like people, like I genuinely enjoy people. I don't want to be in a room with a hundred thousand people at the same time. Like that's too much for me. But I noticed like when I'm talking to people one-on-one or in small groups, when we're having deep conversations, when we're really kind to each other, I'm really loving it. So I really had to unpack. When have I enjoyed talking to people? And that's when I started to like okay with this, with this, with this, okay cool. What types of people do I enjoy being around? Okay, generally, they're kind people, they're good listeners, they're respectful Okay, cool. So it's the really rowdy, toxic ones that you don't like. Okay, now, I understand. I love you, really discerned it for yourself. Oh yeah, absolutely. I was like okay, cool, let's practice this.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 25:23
And I started to seek people out just one-on-one, like let's go out to coffee, let's go out to tea, Can I visit you in your home? Like one-on-one situations, picking the place like a more quiet place that's not too overstimulating. And I realized I'm like I really do have a great personality. I mean, I thought I was just a bump on the log. I really thought that's what I was. I really did, because I spent so much time in overwhelm, discomfort, not accepting myself, that I was just silent in public. Like there are people who are like I've never heard you speak and I'm like that is wild, because the people who know me are like Ibi doesn't stop talking you're like Ibi doesn't stop talking, but you got labeled shy, which a lot of hsps do.
April Snow: 26:18
People misunderstand checking things out or being overwhelmed, the shyness yes, you got put in this box. I'm shy, and then you're, of course, being overstimulated. You do you just kind of want to fade into the background? Yes, because it's intense, and especially if you don't know what's happening for you, it's confusing as a kid. So socializing in general just goes in the bucket of not good.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 26:38
Oh no, we don't do this.
April Snow: 26:40
We don't do this, we don't do it no no, we don't do this. No, wow, what a loss. We sit in our room alone. Yeah, yeah, that's it. And what a loss for you as someone who's social and loves connection. Yes yes, absolutely, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 26:57
No, that was tough because I feel like I lost like a big span of time, you know, just sitting in my room reading books and listening to music, like that's all I did. I was like because and then I was also labeled, on top of that as I got older unfriendly. There was the narrative I be unfriendly and I be doesn't like people. So I was like, oh okay, I'm shy, I'm unfriendly and I don't like people Perfect. So I would literally say I'm shy, I'm unfriendly and I don't like people and I really believed it.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 27:26
Oh, of course it was my identity. So I would just go out, like my mom was like you're not sitting in your room forever, come on, like let's go somewhere. So I'd go out and I'd just be like in the corner, like can I just sit in the car? She's like in the car, it's hot out. No, you can't do that, you know. But once I started finding my people and I also realized that I've always had this intuition, this thing about people. I meet someone and it's either I love this person or danger. Be careful, be very careful about this one. And so now I don't force relationships. I'm able to have a relationship with anyone. But I pay attention to that intuition. Now I'm like that gut, she talks and she's very loud. And once I started listening to to that instinct, I'm like I do love people, I enjoy socializing.
April Snow: 28:21
Now yes, the gut is so accurate and so there's so many things here. So you're realizing how you like to socialize deep one-to-one connections in quiet spaces. And then listening to your gut who are those people you do not want to bring into your inner circle?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 28:42
So important.
April Snow: 28:44
For you personally? What does that instinct feel or sound like? Do you have something that comes up regularly? I know this is different for everyone. I'm just curious what it looks like for you, for folks that maybe are still figuring that out.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 28:57
Yeah. So for me, when I meet someone who's safe, it just feels like the wall goes down. Yeah, the wall goes down and I'm like my ears perk up and I want to ask them a million questions and I really want to get to know them. And when they ask me questions, I feel comfortable and safe enough to actually answer and invite them into my world. But when I meet an unsafe person, it really does feel like my spidey senses are tingling and I want to run Like. It literally feels like I run, and I've never been wrong. I've never.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 29:37
And I'll go back to my childhood and I said that to my mom and she was like you know what, when you were a child, I used you as the yardstick to figure out who I should be around and I was like what does that mean? She says if you let the person hold your hand or if you sat next to the person or you wanted to be in a room with the person, they were a good person. But if you would like look at the person and, kind of like, be standoffish, something would happen in the future and I'd be like, yeah, I saw this coming. So I'm like you knew this this whole time and you never told me Right. So apparently I've always had that instinct and I'm telling you, it's never been wrong.
April Snow: 30:19
It's amazing, isn't it the track record, if you can listen to it. And it's true, it's very loud or clear. Yes, it's either a clear lean in or run away. Yes, absolutely, and it's just. Can we listen to that? Can we trust it?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 30:36
Yeah, I know a lot of people do.
April Snow: 30:37
We should, because it's so accurate.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 30:40
Yes, it is, it absolutely is.
April Snow: 30:42
Oh, I love that your mom saw that she didn't probably know why that was happening, because the language didn't exist. Yeah, when we were, both of us were growing up, but no, it didn't. She noticed something in you yeah yeah, absolutely, absolutely, yeah, yeah. I'm curious are there other challenges that pop up when hsps are socializing that we want to name today?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 31:05
yeah, Sometimes it's the overstimulation you know it's loud people everywhere and and for some HSPs you feel like you are experiencing the emotions of other people. Yes, at least that's the case for me. It's like if you're sad, I can. Like I almost feel like I need to cry when I'm I don't even have to know you. Like I was at the supermarket one day. There was a lady sitting. I think it was having coffee with someone I don't know. There was a lady from across the way and I could not focus on my conversation because I was just like something's going on with that lady over there and I felt the overwhelming need to cry. I didn't cry, but I was like I need to run out of here because something's going on with that lady. I don't even know her.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 31:47
So you have all these people and you're tapping into their emotions. That feels very loud. There's also the element of the unknown. We tend to not like surprises, so I'm not the one to plan like a surprise party. Don't, don't plan a surprise party for me. I don't want to do that. Don't do that to me Like that's awful, that's a horrible birthday for me.
April Snow: 32:06
No, thank you.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 32:07
No, ask questions, you know it's okay to ask. So if you're invited to a space, it's okay to ask, like where's it going to be? Who's going to be there? What's expected of me? I tell people go online and just look, look at pictures of the place, you know, read the menu of the restaurant, so you know what to expect If you don't want to go out with a bunch of complete strangers.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 32:30
You don't have to go out with a bunch of complete strangers. You know you can take a buddy with you like a safe buddy. Or when you get there, use that spidey sense. When you meet someone that you're like, okay, I feel comfortable, that could be your buddy for the night. You know, chat with them.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 32:45
There's this difficulty in having just surface level conversations, right, and that's why a lot of us don't like going to you know social situations, because then they talk about, I don't know, the weather or whatever. I don't even know, but whatever things that we don't care about, right. You don't have to have shallow conversations all the time, you know, but remember like most people have the need to talk about the rain and the sunshine and all of that. So it's like a give and take. So let them, have a little bit of their conversation, and then you can then talk about what do you do for a living and what drew you to this place, and things that feel more meaningful. And if you're not feeling quite super, super safe, but it's an environment that you have to be in. Let's say, for example, you have like a work related event and you have to be there, it's okay to be, just make the conversation about them. You know, and we tend to feel at ease when we're like drawing things out of people, like it's okay, like the conversation doesn't have to be all about you.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 33:46
If you're not comfortable yet, take breaks when you go out, like I am a master of running to the bathroom to take a few deep breaths, like, look, I go there, I take a few deep breaths, I just kind of center myself, I take deep breaths. I go there, I take a few deep breaths, I just kind of center myself, I take deeper. I'm a big fan of ground. I just like two feet on the floor, I'm good, I'm safe, I'm going to be okay, affirming myself and then go back in. Staying in the perimeter of the room is also a great tactic that I use often. I don't enjoy being in the center of the room. I don't know what it is, but I'll just be like in a corner somewhere talking to someone and also it feels like you can escape faster, you can run away. You know, I like that one finding people in the room that feel safe.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 34:34
I I'm saying that over and over again because you don't have to just stand there in the corner all by yourself, you know, have those conversations. You can go outside to take a break as well, you know, just like. Go outside, take a few deep breaths, the fresh air is good for you. Then come back in and you don't have to stay the entire time, because I think we often will compare ourselves to other people. We'll be like, well, they're spending four hours here, you don't have to spend four hours. Go there, do what you need to do and just nicely say, okay, now I'll be going home, thank you for your time, thank you for inviting me and leave. It's also okay If, like that, becomes your MO, like you're the one who leaves an hour early, it's okay.
April Snow: 35:18
That's okay.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 35:19
Right, it's okay. We get worried about being labeled Like Ibi's, the one who always leaves early. I am the one who always leaves early. Yeah, at least I showed up. I showed up and you engaged. I did, you know, I smiled, I was kind and nice to all the people and then I left early and that's it. And I would say, lastly, let's refrain from over explaining when we're in social situations, because sometimes it's you feel anxious. There are people around you, you feel the eyeballs on you. We don't like feeling like we're being watched or we're under pressure. It's okay to just have your little boilerplate statements. Okay, I'm going to be leaving now. Thank you for inviting me. Have a great rest of your evening. I have so many boiler plates that I teach people and then you leave, you know, and that's it, and you can go be in your pajamas and watch TV.
April Snow: 36:09
Yes, Do it your own way, yes, right, and find the way that is somewhat fulfilling, less overwhelming. I love the idea of being on the perimeter, finding a person to anchor to, to co-regulate with, you know, to make you feel a little bit more comfortable and ask those deeper questions. You don't have to talk about the weather, no, you don't, you don't, and some people won't want to go deeper. Maybe that's not the person you talk to, yeah. Or, like I said, maybe you switch the topic, yeah, finding ways that work for you. You switch the topic, finding ways that work for you. I am curious you talked about when you're younger. You kind of stayed at the sides. How does it feel different now when you're also on the sides?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 36:50
It is different. It's so much different. So when I was younger, I stayed on the side so I can disappear, like my goal was if I'm in the corner, they won't see me, and if they don't see me they won't speak to me. That was the goal. Don't talk to me, don't approach me. No eye contact. I'm looking at the floor. Please, don't come near me, please. I just thought the entire world was unsafe. Now I'm staying in the corner so I don't get overwhelmed, but I'm making eye contact with people. I'll sometimes run into the middle, chit, chat a little bit, go back to my corner, so I always have like an anchor spot that I'm at. I'll go in, do what I need to do laugh, chit, chat, giggle, you know, do my little rounds and then I escape again. So it's an in and out thing.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 37:38
I'm not so focused about what they think about me.
April Snow: 37:42
Yes, that feels like the most important part. Yes, it is Is allowing yourself to show up in your own way and to leave when you're ready.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 37:52
Yes.
April Snow: 37:52
And someone might say yes, Ibi is the one that leaves an hour early every time. I am, and you're like that's OK, that works for me. I am. Yeah're like that's okay that works for me.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 38:01
Yeah, what's wrong with that?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 38:02
Yeah, there's nothing you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's fine, it's really fine. I've learned I am not the same as anybody else. I'm, I'm not. I'm not the same as other HSPs. I am a unique being and I'm perfectly fine with that. And everyone does not have to understand me, as long as they respect my boundaries. So that's my thing, like I'm very firm with my boundaries. As long as you're respectful of me, as long as you're kind to me, you might be like that girl is so strange. It's okay. I could see how you could see me as strange. I get it.
April Snow: 38:39
It's fine, right, you're different than probably the majority of other people. You're coming in contact with Me too, and I appreciate that reminder. Every HSP is unique. I think we think we have to be a certain way because we're in a certain group, right? Right, we don't have to be.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 38:53
No.
April Snow: 38:55
No, there are so many other intersections of personality and culture and family and background and just be yourself, yeah, be yourself, it's fine.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 39:03
Yeah, it's fine.
April Snow: 39:04
And I appreciate that. Also that reminder that we can be in the middle. It doesn't have to be I'm super social or I'm super isolating. Yeah, Find somewhere in the middle that works for you. That is absolutely the okay place to be.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 39:15
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And I do have to say that sometimes we think that HSB equals introversion. No, they're extroverted HSBs. They love to be right in the middle of the room socializing, dancing, woohoo. They love the bright lights and it's fine. But then the difference is that what makes us all the same is we do need that downtime to recharge after all of that. So if you're HSB, don't think that means that you're shy. Some HSPs are shy, some are not. Some are introverts, some are not. Some are extroverts, some are not. So you can be unique, even while being in that category of highly sensitive. That's okay. We don't judge, that's it.
April Snow: 39:56
Yeah, do you consider yourself to be extroverted?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 39:59
Oh, no, no, Okay I am. I say I am an introvert, like the most introverted person on the planet.
April Snow: 40:08
I love it. I'm super introverted too, and it's lovely to see that even introverted HSPs can also love connection.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 40:17
Yeah, absolutely Right.
April Snow: 40:18
Because there's this stereotype that we're hermits, we're isolating. We also need connection. Yeah, we like people Just in our own way, on our own time.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 40:31
Yeah, I like that you said that in our own way, in our own time. That's, that's the key, right there.
April Snow: 40:37
It is right. Find your own way through it.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 40:39
Yeah, yeah.
April Snow: 40:40
Yeah, yeah, if there was one message you could leave us HSPs with?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 40:46
what would it be? You can do whatever you want to do. You just have to figure out the how. You can be loud, you can be quiet, you can be ambitious, you can take one thing at a time, you can move slowly, you can move quickly. You just have to figure out what this HSP thing is for you and just figure out how to move through it and you can accomplish things however you want.
April Snow: 41:10
Thank you so much. Ibi this is an amazing conversation and so much to take away and I'm just so happy you came on the podcast. Before we wrap up, yeah, thank you. Definitely will be linking your Instagram which lots of great resources there your website and then your coaching page in the show notes. Could you tell folks a little bit more about your coaching that you offer for highly sensitive?
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 41:32
women. Yes, so I do something, what I like to call the triple T framework. Right, it's just thriving. We learn how to thrive with your emotions. Most of us have just tons of emotions and we're going through that tornado all the time. So I teach you how to move from always overwhelmed to a place where you feel at peace with yourself, calm and secure. So we talk about all of that Again, like I said to April, I don't teach you how to run away from the emotions. We learn how to accept them, how to use them for our good. And then I also teach you how to thrive while being triggered.
Ibinye Osibodu-Onyali: 42:07
If you're HSV, I promise you you will be triggered all the time by your own internal body, by something in the environment, by something somebody does or something somebody says. So, teaching you what your triggers are, which is very different for each person, and what do you do when these triggers show up, so that you don't be a hermit like I used to be, because there's a big life out there for you to live and I would love everyone to be able to live fully. And finally, how to thrive in relationships, because HSPs are relational people. We might not want to be in a room with a hundred thousand people, but we can build really strong, safe, healthy relationships. I'm talking about work relationships, home relationships, all types of relationships. How to set those boundaries, what to say when people you know say things that just rub you the wrong way, and just how to feel secure when you're around people.
April Snow: 43:03
Beautiful, what a great resource. I mean, we will be triggered, it's true, and we do want to be in relationship. It's just finding the path, yes, and what better than having another HSP to guide us? Yes, who gets it? Yes, oh, so beautiful. Thanks so much for joining me and Ibi for today's conversation. What I hope you remember is that your sensitivity is real, it's valid and it's absolutely okay to show up. However, you need to and for more support, schedule a coaching session with Ibi to learn how to prioritize your own needs, speak up for yourself, set clear boundaries and become much more comfortable in your own skin. You'll find that link in the show notes. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to the Sensitive Stories podcast so you don't miss our upcoming conversations. Reviews and ratings are also helpful and appreciated For behind-the-scenes content and more HSP resources. You can sign up for my email list or follow Sensitive Strengths on Instagram, tiktok and YouTube. Check out the show notes or sensitivestoriescom for all the resources from today's episode. Thanks for listening.
